Flying Tigers AVG Board

Topic : Missing Names


Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 14, 2010, 11:33 am
My Grandfather was a Panda and he asked about several others I can't find any of the names including his. He says he was AVG never went to the 14th he left July 1942 and then flew or Delta. the Names he asked about were Bob Oconnell, Ernest Gant, Jack Fry, Robert Parks. I can't find them on any roster.
He was a wing man and remembers Tex well. Please help if you can.

Edited by hawkadoodle : October 22, 2010, 4:36 pm

Posted By: chuckbaisden on October 14, 2010, 12:08 pm | Post: 1

Might be able to help if I knew your grandfathers name ????

Chuck Baisden

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 14, 2010, 10:39 pm | Post: 2
Long Story Short, I believe he flew under the name Robert (Bob) O'Connoll (my spelling could be off) He knew Jack Newkirk and told me about the day he passed.

Posted By: BillC on October 15, 2010, 12:33 pm | Post: 3
None of those men were AVG members. Tex Hill was one of the pilots that stayed on with the CATF and the later 14th AF after the AVG disbanded on July 4, 1942. He may have known Tex from the later units. I'm somewhat confused though, you mention that your grandfather was Robert O'Connell, but you also say that he asked about 'Robert O'Connell'....? Can you clarify his name? If he was in the AVG his name would appear on the master list of original members, whether he completed his 1 year contract or not.

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 15, 2010, 11:41 pm | Post: 4
One of the reason's for asking is when I say he flew under his name, My grand father joined the AVG without family permission and slightly underage. He took the name of another guy  he was with to hide from the family (and I'm sure sneak in underage) He searved till July 19th 1942. He said Bissell(sp?) asked him to stay on for the 14th but he said no.  I remember pictures when I was younger of him and some other guys in front of a p40? over there. (amoung other pictures) He's never been extremely forth coming with me before but now he's talking about it more and asking my help to find stuff. I'm trying to help with his request.  he was AVG & Panda.
I appreciate all your help.

Edited by hawkadoodle : October 22, 2010, 4:47 pm

Posted By: BillC on October 16, 2010, 1:31 am | Post: 5
Well.....there was a "Moose' Moss that was an original member of the AVG. If you could provide some further information about his post-war activities, I'm sure that someone could confirm his being a member of the AVG.

Posted By: ForumAdmin on October 16, 2010, 8:25 am | Post: 6

There were only two members of the AVG with the last name Moss, neither of whom is still living.

Jo Neal

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 16, 2010, 10:59 pm | Post: 7
He tells me the person whose name he used for so many years passed away many years ago. I'm going to speak with him tomorrow and see what else he will share with me. I know he is now more upset about the fact that the medals he earned have someone elses name attached instead of his real one. At the time I know kids don't think that far into the future.
I have a bracelet made from his wings. I would love to get clear all I can for him.  Thank you to everyone for helping! I will try to get more info from him to help our cause :)

Edited by hawkadoodle : October 22, 2010, 4:40 pm

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 18, 2010, 11:38 am | Post: 8
I spoke with My grand pa, Jack Newkirk brought him in under an assumed name and the few guys that knew were supposed to keep it hush hush that even if he died over there it wouldn't have been "him" He said some of the guys knew once he was there for a while and kept it quiet. 

Edited by hawkadoodle : October 22, 2010, 4:45 pm

Posted By: chuckbaisden on October 18, 2010, 4:10 pm | Post: 9

By chance, I wonder if you know where and when the  real AVG pilot Moose Moss died and where is he buried?

I am getting more and more confused and the ice is getting thin.

Chuck Baisden
3rd Sqdn AVG 1941-42

Posted By: BillC on October 18, 2010, 4:25 pm | Post: 10
A further head why none of the names he asked about were AVG members? If he did not stay on with the CATF after the AVG disbanded, he wouldn't have known the members of the later groups that replaced the AVG, so we must assume he wasn't asking about them. Also, Bissell couldn't have asked him to stay on with the 14th didn't exist...until about 9-10 months after the AVG disbanded. The China Air Task Force was the initial replacement unit for the AVG. I never heard of anyone 'recruiting' AVG members other than General Chennault and the original recruiters that visited the various bases around the US.  I don't know how he could have used Moose Moss' name since Moose was in the AVG the entire time. His contract was not 'empty' or 'open' for anyone to fill. The other 'Moss' in the group was Ken Moss, a meteorologist, and he also completed his contract. There seem to be a number of inconsistencies that don't add up. Some wires must be crossed somewhere.

Edited by BillC : October 18, 2010, 4:52 pm

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 19, 2010, 1:13 am | Post: 11
He said he was with the AVG since inseption.  He talked about the CATF but he said he left the service July 19th 1942. ( He told me the AVG dibanded earlier. He gave me the date but I forgot to write it down. 
was there a Henry Gilbert that died in a landing accident over there?
I'm getting all this info by phone but he said he would drag out some old pics he has and send them to me to maybe help clarify. One of the pictures has several of the guys, my grandfather and a couple of chinese men with them in the picture.
thanks again and sorry if its getting confusing I'm hoping it all gets straight in the end.  :)

Edited by hawkadoodle : October 22, 2010, 4:49 pm

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 19, 2010, 1:39 am | Post: 12
Other names he asked about Arvid Olsen, Lewis Hoffman ( he told me he died in action at the age of 43?)  somebody Oley (ok my spelling doesn't look right on that one) I have to check my notes I know he gave me more names. 

Edited by hawkadoodle : October 22, 2010, 4:50 pm

Posted By: BillC on October 19, 2010, 9:18 am | Post: 13
Odd that he would ask about those particular AVG names. None of them were in the squadron that he claims to have been in. One would think that several names from 'his' squadron would first come to mind. A question: Was he trained in Texas  specifically in preparation for the AVG mission in China?

Edited by BillC : October 19, 2010, 9:34 am

Posted By: hawkadoodle on October 19, 2010, 10:36 am | Post: 14
Hi Bill,
Yes I believe so.  I keep trying to compile info based on short phone conversations.  It was my mistake on the 14th division, I just assumed that was the division that came after the AVG as that is the one mentioned here the most as an alternitive if you weren't AVG. (he corrected me too LOL )
I again assumed that those names were associated with the same squad.  I've wrote down others but are not near my notes at the moment.  (I need to really stop assuming :) ) Were the squads seperate from one another? or did you have contact?

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